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Vassula in Paris, November 2018
Invitation to debate interfaith subjects on a television show in Paris.

November 24, 2018

In the summer of 2018, Vassula received an invitation from Evangelist Pastor Said Oujibou to debate interfaith subjects on a television show in Paris.  Said Oujibou is a well-known multicultural show animator for programs such as "Liberté, Egalité, Couscous", where he explains the necessity to better understand the diversity of religion and culture in order for all to live in peace.

The debate was scheduled to take place in the crypt "Sainte Jeanne d' Arc" (Saint Joan of Arc) situated underneath the Church of 'St-Denys' de la Chapelle, in Paris.  France seems to be favoured; in the thirty years of Vassula's public testimonial around the world; fifty-six conferences were held in this nation, of which thirteen were in Paris. 

The True Life in God French team prepared accommodation for Vassula's arrival, as well as setting-up the conference room inside the crypt, decorating it, and making sure the conferencing hardware was functional.

At 2:30 pm, before the debate, Rev’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden (Anglican, Missionary Bishop of the Christian Episcopal Church in the United Kingdom and Europe) introduced Vassula to the French public.  In her 50 minute speech, Vassula reminded them why "God was calling us" and invited them to see the "signs of the times." 

Rev’d Gavin introduces Vassula to the public

 Rev’d Dr. Gavin introduces Vassula to the public

Vassula Speaking to the Public1

Vassula Speaking to the Public2

Vassula Speaking to the Public

Vassula’s testimony, in its substance, was the following:

 Vassula asked, “Why does God call us?”  She explained that God always manifested Himself to mankind, not so as to give us something new, but so as to respell His Word, reminding us of our foundations.  God will never in our lifetime cease calling us.  He invites us all to enter into the true and unique knowledge of His Deity, the knowledge of knowing Him and of understanding Him.  Our Lady says in a TLIG message:

what God wants of you is a change of heart; do not be afraid to acknowledge your sins; live and practise the sacrament of confession;” (True Life in God Messages, April 23, 1993)

All these calls from heaven are lessons like those in a school.  Jesus calls His school, “True Life in God.” He invites everyone to this school. 

Vassula said that after having passed through a purifying fire, Jesus trained and taught her with patience and tenderness.  He educated her on spiritual things.  His teaching was divine, giving her cognitive lights to penetrate His words and understand them. 

Vassula spoke about Apostasy, explaining that this is a rebellion against God.  She said that Jesus explains in the TLIG Messages that we are living in a great apostasy; that is why He had to intervene. This apostasy was predicted by St. Paul. He said that we would recognize the End of Times by two signs: apostasy and the spirit of rebellion. Our era has both signs and they are quite visible!  Of course, God, in His Great Mercy, will intervene. God intervenes to call us to repent!   Vassula read a message from Our Blessed Mother:

“... your generation failed to appreciate God's great Love, this is why your lands are set aflame by egoism, by godlessness and by the fury of Satan; (...)  I call in agony from above, to you all to make peace with God, to reconcile with your families;” (TLIG Messages,  October 10, 1990)

Vassula emphasised about a chastisement by fire that would happen if we did not repent and make peace with God. “…On the Day of Judgment, He will hold us responsible for all kinds of indifferences we have had… We should therefore examine ourselves and correct ourselves; otherwise he will drive us all out as He did in the past with the Israelites!”

She added that, “we live in a time of ineffable grace and Mercy. God is renewing His Creation. He is rising-up new apostles of the End of Times and they will become pillars of faith and defenders of Truth”. 

"I am, renewing, Vassula, My creation; it is the beginning of this renewal; it is My passage among the tombs, among this vast graveyard, My passage will turn the tombs into glorious Cathedrals with the Fire of My Love within them! the splendour of My Presence in them will be awesome;" (TLIG Messages, May 31, 2003)

Vassula said that the Blessed Virgin Mary, Queen of Peace, appears in many places around the world.   As the Lord says, she is preparing us for Christ’s Return, which is imminent.  She also said that the manifestations of Christ today are many.  He even appears to non-Christians.  There is a multiplication of the appearances of Christ among non-Christians. She talked about the New Heavens and the New Earth, where God is renewing everything by giving us joy and peace in our soul: by transfiguring our soul into that of a new person.

Vassula talked also about the importance of forgiveness and love, about repentance, and about the power of prayer, with a lesson on how to pray, because it is through prayer that we can reach God.  She emphasised that we must remember that on Judgement Day we will all be judged by the measure of love we had here on earth.  The Lord says in a message: 

"yes, a word uttered with love can alter a whole situation; it can stop a war; it can melt ice and calm down a storm; it can extinguish a fire;" (TLIG Messages, May 31, 2003)

The Blessed Virgin says:  “A prayer of the heart vibrates with truth and God hears it!” When we pray for others, it is as if we are pouring our blood for them, because our love is like the Love of Christ who had no personal interest;” (cf. TLIG Messages, “Vassula Speaks about Witnessing”)

Vassula said: “I invite you today to learn and follow the footsteps of the ancient prophets, and to open a broad path in your mind and heart to see how they have maintained their perfect fidelity to God when He had them called to reveal His plans to them: Let us learn from them and meditate on their travel through these arid lands, these spiritual deserts.

On the spiritual path, they learned self-denial, giving priority to God’s interests and God Himself.  They learned to shed their ego and their will.

Today, let us become aware of their indomitable courage, their zeal and their love for God.  They were also human and possessed no more than what we have, except they had a good will to glorify God.  They were weak, but God gave them His strength.  They did not have an easy life, but they struggled, putting their trust in God, and persevering to fulfil their mission and glorify God.

  • If every human being responded to God’s Love, displayed by Him for each one of us in His True Life in God Messages, our lives would be transformed into a Love Hymn.
  • If people took seriously Christ’s warnings about Satan's rage in these last days, he would already be defeated and banished from men’s hearts and the world.
  • If all the world’s religions responded to God's call to reconciliation, all men and women would have already recognized each other as brothers and sisters from one Source.
  • And if everyone realized that we are living in times of ineffable Grace and  Mercy, and that God, in full power, is renewing His creation, we would never cease praising God night and day, and our hearts would become blazing flames of zeal!
  • If only…”
After Vassula's speech, the public was invited to take a break at the rear of the conference room, with some refreshments, tea and cookies offered by Saïd Oujibou and the French TLIG, so as to learn about and get to know each other, each one sharing information about his/her individual attachment to his/her  respective faith. 
At 3:30 pm, the designated interfaith speakers each took a seat for the debate.  Facing the public, from right to left, were:
Josephine Daherel Ghoul, (Journalist and TV director  of a channel for the young), Nour Alshaba, (from Télé Lumière, and a liturgical television channel), Nour Al Kodass, (ecumenical focus for all denominations.  She has a Doctoral degree in media and a Graduate degree in journalism from Paris 2 Sorbonne). Pierre Barnerias, (Journalist and ex 'Grand Reporter', he is also the director of the movie "M and the third secret"), Said Oujibou, (Host and debate presenter ); Vassula Ryden, Rev’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden (Bishop of the Diocese of Great Britain and Europe for the Christian Episcopal Church), Mohamed Khenissi (Islamologist), Fr Jean-Louis Haubert (Catholic priest of the Diocese of Strasbourg and chaplain of the University Hospital of Strasbourg), Camel Bechikh (President of the ‘Daughters and Sons of France’ and member of the Board of the Bordeaux Mosque)

The Speakers for the interfaith debate

Debate Members

The debate took place under the theme:

'How to live together in peace under the Creator's Eye'

During the debate, the following remarks were given:

Pierre Barnérias: (about the appearances of the Virgin) "The Church has always been cautious about the Apparitions, so everything that the Virgin has announced has not been said... The Virgin Mary, the perfect woman is a point of commonality between Christians and Muslims."

Mohamed Khenissi believes that it is important to transmit the history of the prophets to the young.

Vassula Ryden: "There was a silence in the movie M and the 3rd Secret.  The Secret was revealed and the publication was not made.  Cardinal Ratzinger at the Vatican said that the Message of Akita (Japan) is the Secret of Fatima.  He says that we have fallen into apostasy and calls us to repentance; if we do not repent, there will be the punishment of fire. (...) generalized apostasy is the sign of the End Times (2nd Thess.)..."

Said OUJIBOU  with Josephine EL GHOUL and Pierre BARNERIAS

Said Oujibou (Host and presenter of the debate) with Josephine El Ghoul (Journalist and director of TV channel "TV Lumière"); Pierre Barnerias, (Journalist and ex 'Grand Reporter'. He is also the director of the movie "M and the third secret.")

Mohamed Khenissi: "We are waiting for the return of Jesus who will finish his Mission. We must prepare His return together..."

Camel Bechikh: "To know if the Virgin has appeared or not is anecdotal ... being able to learn about other religions in order to take comfort from one's own is central.  Vassula's speech is rallying; we feel love, a return to love, delivering us from the Evil One.  Love is universal.  If we do not practise discernment, we fall into division, that is to say evil ...”

Josephine El Ghoul: "With dialogue, we can praise and sing to the Lord."

Rv’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden: "It is necessary to have discernment to recognize love and holiness.  For that, one must be close to God.  It is not enough to be Catholic or Orthodox ... We receive the food of the Holy Spirit Himself, which is holiness.  In society, there is a great division.  If the Church is divided, she is weak.  When we take all the food of the Holy Spirit, we can become fire in love and in holiness.  Why are the churches empty?  Because there is no love and holiness...”

Mohamed Khenissi: "Adults can help young people to practice the Faith.  We refer to their religious identity (eg. Muslims) and we forget that they are young people ... it is necessary to be creative, to think how to teach, to organise outdoor activities, surrounded by nature and to discover the Creator, to try to be innovative; ... not to give into fear; God asks me to share my Faith with the universe. "

Camel Bechikh: "National identity; we do not have the right to speak about it in France ... We can integrate the habits and customs of the national integrity while keeping a religious identity.”

Vassula Ryden: "In Lebanon I saw a mosaic of confessions and religions within one community: no divisions, no prejudice, and no separations.  We must meet today as ecumenical and inter-religious."

Pierre Barnerias: "The End Times is not the end of the world.  The most important moment is Judgment.  The most important thing is God and the moment when we present ourselves before God. "

Father Jean-Louis Haubert: "When we do not live according to God, we contribute to apostasy.  Through sin, we help the evil one.  When one lives the True Life in God, one opposes the evil one and the apostasy.  The end of the world and end times: The end times are the end of evil, when the evil one will no longer have power over the heart of the man.  When Lucifer has been chained, the end of evil will come.  Then there will be the end of the world, which is in the Hands of the Lord. "

Said OUJIBOU with Vassula Ryden, and Rvd Gavin ASHENDEN

Said Oujibou (Host and presenter of the debate), with Vassula Ryden, and Rv’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden

Vassula Ryden: "It will be 33 years of messages on November 28, when I started looking for God ... In these messages there is the 2nd Pentecost that gives a lot of hope.  The Holy Spirit is poured out on all humanity.  The end of time is the 2nd Pentecost that will renew the world. There will be a new heaven, a new earth; there will be no darkness.  On earth, we will all live under the same sun and we will form one great family.  As human beings, we have the same needs, a good health etc ... we must take a path of righteousness and live it, that our life be transformed and transfigure the world.  The Creator has inscribed on each human heart the capacity for good, but when we find ourselves in rebellion against Him this capacity for good becomes a capacity for evil. Nature that revolts, originates from all kinds of conflicts in our hearts.  If we have no place for the Divine in our hearts, it will become externalized and it will be war.  The Lord once said to me, "live as though it is your last day on earth;" (TLIG Messages, March 2, 1993)

We must work together to fill the gaps in our divisions - education in the family - institutions and religious communities - actions that make it possible to live.  All religions respond to the Call of God.  They can unite as long as they learn to love.  Peace, harmony, unity is a desire for all of us, and above all for God, and to be able to say: my brother, my sister. "

Rev. Dr. Gavin Ashenden, Mohamed Khenissi, Fr Jean-Louis Haubert, and Camel Bechikh
Rev. Dr. Gavin Ashenden, Mohamed Khenissi, Fr Jean-Louis Haubert, and Camel Bechikh

Camel Bechikh: "Extremists have a violent interpretation of Texts (Koran, Bible, Human Rights)"

Rv’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden: "If you are violent, you are no longer a Christian. For the Christian who is violent, we must ask him to repent.”

Vassula Ryden: "Christians who do violence must be evangelized.  Jesus once asked me, ‘Am I a politician?’ Jesus asks us to : ‘Do your best and I will do the rest.’ We cannot do the impossible because it is God who does the impossible. We must never stop carrying out meetings. "

Pierre Barnérias: (on the media) "Information is manipulated, distorted, and even criminal.  Three major news agencies spread hatred during the events of 11 September.  We live in the world of snapshots and manipulation".

Josephine El Ggoul: "A 60-year-old blind Christian woman, lived with a Muslim family who sheltered her so that she could be safe and have something to eat ... When we spend the time loving, we do not have time to do the harm.”

Camel Bechikh: "There is a politicization of the reading of the Bible in the Arab world.  Who benefits from the attacks in the West?  Islam has never been as ugly as since the attacks.  There is a bellicose reading of the Koran in the USA.”

Vassula Ryden: "God does not stop working; He is always in action.  What is needed is conversion and having a radical change in ourselves.  Live and put into action every Word He says.  Prayer without ceasing is contemplative prayer, the highest prayer.  It is necessary to die to oneself to be transfigured.  If you live as Jesus asks, you will testify, but without ever imposing what you believe, being zealous but not fanatical. "

Camel Bechikh: "We must spread the Word; we must be the Gospel in action."

Vassula Ryden: "The Lord says," Be My Echo, imitate Me."

Mohamed Khenissi: "We find God; we see God in the other."

Camel Bechikh: "We tend to define ourselves as religious in relation to the religion of the other.”

Josephine El Ghoul: "… In the second year of journalism, I saw how my comrades were arguing over opinions, and I told myself that I must stop studying journalism; Brother Nour, (a priest) came to tell me: "No, Josephine, the war is over and we are going to build a television where the word will be free; and it is today the channel 'Télé Lumière' that has five channels to proclaim the Word, the 'real Word' .. On our channels, we only say the words that encourage union and love."

When asked about the main theme (“How to live together in peace under the Creator's Eye”) Vassula gave this beautiful answer:

“First, we must recognize that these times we live in is what we call the End Times, not the end of the world, but the end of an era.  In the messages that Jesus dictates to me, He told me that there would be two signs to recognize these times.  The first sign: The great apostasy, the second sign: the spirit of rebellion.  We have both these signs today.

That is why, God, in His great Mercy and Goodness, intervenes and sends us warning signs. One of the signs is the many appearances of Jesus in our day, and of Mary the Blessed Virgin.  The True Life in God work is also a great sign given to everyone.  Here is what Jesus said: ‘...hear Me and write My message for the entire world;’ (TLIG Messages, October 10, 1990) So we all have not only an important role to play in maintaining peace and unity in diversity, but an obligation.

All these signs are given to prepare us for the return of Christ.  Christ in the messages insists time and time again that we must be prepared, calling us to repentance.  He repeats several times: ‘My Return is imminent,’ (TLIG Messages, December 27, 1994) and: "by the road that I came on I will return;" (TLIG Messages, July 22, 1992)

The Blessed Virgin is sent by God to prepare us for the glorious return of Christ.  One of the messages of Christ explains it; I took extracts: "-tell Me, when a king enters a city, will there be no preparations to receive him? the whole city will be in turmoil and the king will send before him his elect and his imperial court to prepare the way for him and make his paths straight; he will send his messengers to announce his coming;... this is why, before My Return, I am sending you before Me, the Ark of Alliance, I am sending you the Woman of the Apocalypse, the second Eve," (TLIG Messages, October 10, 1990)

Many times Jesus warns us in His messages that His Return is imminent, the Day of Judgment is near, and that on this great day we will all be judged by fire. We will be judged according to the measure of the love we had on earth.  The meaning of our lives is therefore to love God and serve him, and to love our neighbour and not to differentiate him.

The Blessed Virgin says that those who are of different religions are no less creatures made in the Image of God and are ultimately destined to live in the House of God.

As I said before, only after repentance can we obtain the grace of Heaven to understand that our divisions are a sin.  Let us understand that God unites, but the devil divides.

We must not forget that on earth we all live under the same sun and we are one great family equal under the Light of God, regardless of our creed or what part of the world we come from. And as humans, we basically have the same needs; we all seek happiness, we all want to have good health. Who among us does not like peace and to be happy? Who among us does not like being healthy?  Nobody...

In all religions, there is always a holy law to follow.  This Law is supposed to lead us to holiness so that we are worthy in the Eyes of God.  We must take this Holy Way of Righteousness, be it a Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Jewish or other law, and we must live it, not just know it, so that our lives can be transformed, and, by this transformation we can transform the world. We must be like a city built on a hill which cannot be hidden!

Our Creator has imprinted in the consciousness of all His creation what is good and what is bad. Now everyone has noticed that the world is in bad shape.  Corruption, violence and suffering have increased.  The origin of all kinds of conflicts is usually located in our hearts, where they are well rooted.  Our heart is like a mirror of our soul.  It reflects what we have of Him.  If in our hearts we have no room for the divine and instead bring hatred and war, these feelings will be exteriorized and they will become a reality, because a man's actions flow from what fills his heart.  It must be understood that God is not moved by the eloquence of words or affected by their elocution, but He delights in a contrite heart.

Jesus Christ in one of His messages instructs us and says: 'live as though it is your last day on earth;' (TLIG Messages, March 2, 1993)

It is therefore our responsibility to one another to cultivate a global awareness of justice to put an end to this evil and division among people; it is to listen to the needy; we have the capacity if we strive more to diligently work together to fill the gaps in our divisions instead of aggravating them; we should become repairers of breaches, repairing our differences and promoting peace where there is war, unity where there is division, love where there is hatred.

We need a solution.  The first thing that needs to be considered is education, which will resolve conflict by instilling a thirst for truth.  We need to educate the family, institutions, our religious communities, the whole world, telling them that men can live in peace and harmony, and can reconcile with each other.  The answer to the question: What are the actions that make it possible to live together and build a city of peace under the eyes of the Creator?  If all the religions of the world responded to God's call to reconciliation, all men and women would recognize each other as brothers and sisters from one Source.

Yes, they can unite, as long as they learn to love; reminding themselves of their Divine origin and moral values.  We must remind them to become the Image of the living God, or of our saints, who have no trace of impurity, no trace of prejudice, no trace of vengeance, no trace of hatred. I sincerely hope that the day will come, when through our efforts and our sacrifices, we will bring the peace, harmony and unity that are so desired by all of us, but above all, by God, and that one day we can sincerely say to each other "my brother, my sister".”

Finally, the participants were asked to add a conclusion: 

Josephine El Ghoul: "Being close to each other and loving each other"
Pierre Barnerias: "To believe in the existence of Eternity; one is made for Eternity."
Mohamed Khenissi: "We are responsible for the lessons we shared."
Rv’d Dr. Gavin Ashenden: "to pray, to love, to repent"
Camel Bechikh: "To be voices that meet the voices that divide."

Vassula Ryden: "Our heart is in the Heart of God who tells us: ‘My Holy Spirit can transfigure you from a desert into a garden, into a palace where I can reign over you, change your heart to a Paradise and in this Paradise, you can glorify Me;’”
                                          (cf. TLIG Messages, April 22, 1990) 

Around 200 people were gathered at this event, dated November 24, 2018 in Paris.

Neil Labbé de Montais
TLIG Reader 
TLIG, French Organizers



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